Karl Josef Kardinal Becker, SJ After After All

+AMDG+

P. Karl Josef Becker, SJ

I thought I might draw our reader’s attention to the abrupt re-reversal of Fr. Becker’s fortunes.  According to the most recent statements, Fr. Becker will be created cardinal in the consistory of Feb. 18 after all.  If Fr. Becker was truly prevented from attending the consistory per motivi saluti, then it seems he has been cured miraculously.  Deus providebit.

  Here is a translation of the German-language announcement on Vatican Radio:

Fr. Karl Joseph Becker is pleased to able to participate in the Consistory on February 18.  So spoke the longstanding Professor of Theology on Vatican Radio.  A week ago it was announced by the Vatican that reasons of health (Gesundheitsgründe) impeded Becker’s participation, and that the conferral of the cardinalate would therefore take place at another moment and private.  The cited reasons (Gründe) no longer exist, according to Fr. Becker.  He has always rejoiced in the recognition and confidence of the Pope, which has found expression in this nomination.  He has now received the message specifying his participation at the consistory of February 18.

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5 Responses to Karl Josef Kardinal Becker, SJ After After All

  1. Amen, so be it, et al’ hmmmm me wonders?????
    An Obama reversed his stand, also Amen Amen

  2. Lionel Andrades says:

    Tuesday, February 14, 2012
    EXTRA ECCLESIAM NULLA SALUS CARDINAL-DESIGNATE NOT TO BE PRESENT AT CONSISTORY

    Fr.Karl Becker S.J who showed that there was no change of doctrine with the term subsistist it will be created a cardinal at a private ceremony

    Fr. Karl Josef Becker, S.J., emeritus professor at the Gregorian University, Rome due to ill health will be created a cardinal in a private ceremony. The Jesuit priest teaches that only the Catholic Church can be identified as the Church of Christ. The Orthodox Christians and Protestants are not the Church of Christ is his orthodox view.

    The true Church of Christ exists in only the Catholic Church he says and elements of this one true Church could exist in the Orthodox Christian churches and those in partial communion with the Catholic Church.

    The cardinal -designate is affirming the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus which says all need to convert into the Catholic Church for salvation. The dogma Cantate Domino, Council of Florence specifically mentions the Orthodox Christians and Protestants needing to convert into the Catholic Church for salvation.According to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus the Church of Christ is the Catholic Church.

    The cardinal-designate recognizes Lumen Gentium 8 and 16 and suggests that there is the possibility of a non Catholic being saved.However since these cases are not defacto known to us, Vatican Council II does not contradict the dogma. The dogma says everyone needs to be an explicit, visible member of the Catholic Church to avoid the fires of Hell.

    Elements of the one true Church could exist outside the visible boundaries of the Catholic Church and they would be known only to God. So Lumen 8 is not an exception to the dogma outside the church no salvation. Instead Vatican Council II (Ad Gentes 7 and Lumen Gentium 14 ) agree with Lumen Gentium 8 (subsistit it).It says that Catholic faith and the baptism of water are needed by all for salvation (to avoid Hell). Lumen Gentium 8 is not contradicted by Lumen Gentium 16 (invincible ignorance/good conscience) since these cases are unknown to us in the present times.So the true Church of Christ is the Catholic Church and all need to enter it for salvation and there are no defacto exceptions known to us.

    Fr.Karl Becker participated in the recent talks between the SSPX /FSSP and the Vatican in which most if not all the participants assumed that those saved in invincible ignorance, the baptism of desire, good conscience, the seeds of the Word, elements of sannctification and in imperfect communion are explicitly known to us in particular cases. Hence they are a defacto exception to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus. In other words one could telephone them or meet them on the street.-Lionel Andrades

    CARDINAL DESIGNATE FR. KARL BECKER SAYS THE CHURCH OF CHRIST IS THE CATHOLIC CHURCH ONLY

    http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.com/2012/02/cardinal-designate-fr-karl-becker-says.html#links

    • Aaron Pidel, SJ says:

      Hmmm … I don’t know that Cardinal Becker would want to formulate his position in exactly those words. The point about “subsistit in” in LG 8 is that the Catholic Church, as an objective body/entity/institution, is the one that Christ willed his followers to enter, the one to which He is united as a head to a body. It affirms that the true Church of Christ, the Church that Christ has endowed with the fullness of the means of salvation, exists in this world (not only in the next) and can be identified as such. It is only indirectly related, I would say, to the ancient pronouncement, “Extra ecclesiam nulla salus.”
      As you point out, the Church clearly teaches that those in good conscience can still be saved, even if not baptized. I don’t think that the way of resolving the apparent contradiction with “extra ecclesiam” formula is to insist that only God can presently identify either pagans in good faith or the invincibly ignorant (therefore, your line of reasoning suggests, making the “extra ecclesiam” rule impossible for us to disprove). With the exception of the saints, we are not able to identify any of the saved with certainty (only God can); and this agnosticism is to be directed toward non-canonized, baptized Catholics as well as toward unbaptized pagans. By the logic of your position, it seems that we would actually have to reformulate the rule more narrowly: “Extra sanctos canonizatos, nulla salus.” The rule would stand, by the same logic, because no one could produce counter-examples with any certainty.

  3. Lionel Andrades says:

    Fr.Aaron Pidel S.J:
    Hmmm … I don’t know that Cardinal Becker would want to formulate his position in exactly those words. The point about “subsistit in” in LG 8 is that the Catholic Church, as an objective body/entity/institution, is the one that Christ willed his followers to enter, the one to which He is united as a head to a body. It affirms that the true Church of Christ, the Church that Christ has endowed with the fullness of the means of salvation, exists in this world (not only in the next) and can be identified as such. It is only indirectly related, I would say, to the ancient pronouncement, “Extra ecclesiam nulla salus.”

    Lionel:
    It is indirectly related to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus, is a positive statement. Thank you.
    Fr.Aaron:
    As you point out, the Church clearly teaches that those in good conscience can still be saved, even if not baptized.
    Lionel:
    Correct. However the Church does not teach that those saved with a good cosncience are known to us or that they are exceptions to the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus. Neither does any Church text say that Lumen Gentium 8 (subsistist it ) is a contradiction of Lumen Gentium 14 and Ad Gentes 7 which says all need Catholic Faith and the baptism of water for salvation. Neither does the Church say that Lumen Gentium 16 (good conscience/invincible ignorance) is an exception to the Lumen Gentium 8.
    Fr.Aaron:
    I don’t think that the way of resolving the apparent contradiction with “extra ecclesiam” formula
    Lionel:
    There is no apparent contradiction since the dogma says all need to convert into the Church to avoid the fires of Hell. We do not know any defacto exceptions on earth.
    Fr.Aaron:
    is to insist that only God can presently identify either pagans in good faith or the invincibly ignorant (therefore, your line of reasoning suggests, making the “extra ecclesiam” rule impossible for us to disprove).
    Lionel:
    To imply that we can identify a non Catholic saved in invincible ignorance etc is irrational.
    It is also a criticism of Magisterial texts. It would mean that the Letter of the Holy Office 1949 says defacto every one needs to enter the Church (reference to the dogma, the infallibe teaching) and it also says there can be non Catholics saved defacto in invincible ignorance and the baptism of desire. This would mean that the Letter contradicts the Principle of Non Contradiction.
    It would also mean that the popes and Councils made an error with respect to a defined dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus.
    Fr.Aaron:
    With the exception of the saints, we are not able to identify any of the saved with certainty (only God can);
    Lionel:True.
    Fr.Aaron:
    and this agnosticism is to be directed toward non-canonized, baptized Catholics as well as toward unbaptized pagans.
    Lionel:
    If you reject extra ecclesiam nulla salus and the magisterial teachings which say all need to enter the Church for salvation.(Dominus Iesus 20, CCC 845,846, Letter of the Holy Office 1949(reference to the dogma, the infallible statemet ) etc.
    Fr.Aaron:
    By the logic of your position, it seems that we would actually have to reformulate the rule more narrowly: “Extra sanctos canonizatos, nulla salus.” The rule would stand, by the same logic, because no one could produce counter-examples with any certainty.
    Lionel.
    The Church tells us that those who are canonized as saints are in Heaven. So we accept this. The Church through the salvation dogma and other magisterial texts indicate that all non Catholics with no exception are oriented to Hell.

    • Aaron Pidel, SJ says:

      I’ll let the fair readers of WD decide whether you’ve followed (and responded to) the logic of my argument. Thanks for your input.

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